New Jampot.

crawsue · Post by **crawsue** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 5:54 pm

Just received this months Jampot,and their on the cover was what I coveted and lusted after back in the late sixties,sleek lines,gorgeous curves and all covered in tight leather trousers!'Bikes not to shabby ,either!Nice one,Chris,gives us the will to live through another January.Edited by - crawsue on 12 Jan 2009 5:55:48 PM

rex.webb · Post by **rex.webb** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 6:56 pm

I like the Boots !! "Daytona" on them,reminds me of times spent there with the late Ernie Dorsett.
PS How is it a "MATCHLESS" has "AJS" blue paintwork??.At least the Lady has a RED top on.
Ride with Care and Live Long.

Groily · Post by **Groily** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:44 pm

Groily · Post by **Groily** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:20 pm

OOPs! Brain not engaged. Sorry about the blank.

Re the new Jampot, yes, like the cover. Like the boots, like the bike . . . and of course like the lady. Like everything on the outside.

But I thought the inside gave pause for thought. Not only the Ed's pained comment about the lack of ads (- nice to see period advertisements used to fill up the space that had been allocated in advance to Sale and Wanted, but not good from any other point of view).

Troubling to me was the resurrection of old stuff about the purpose of the club: profit-generator vs snug-bar for the members, etc etc.
For the first time in ages I had to go rustling through the downstairs bog-books to see what on earth had been written before to cause such a flurry.

Seems to me that there are those who, because there's a recession on, would like to see the club's commercial enterprises shut down pronto just in case they might not prosper if allowed to continue. Probably because they didn't support them in the first place. The rationale seems to be to pour enough cold water and see what freezes. Like my plumbing this past week.

Bad plan I think.

I felt for Jim Gunn at JSL spares having to refute at such length a list of, I thought, loaded queries. I think he did it very well. Seems to me the economic climate has provided a convenient hook for re-opening a debate that should have been closed when the Committee made the decisions it made a while back to incorporate KCS into the organisation. But there's nothing like re-opening a cold case when an excuse presents.

No skin off my nose, I live far away . . . except for the fact that I have always had great service from JSL, as also from all Surbeys always and from a lot of other people as well. I wish every single one of them well, for this marque as well as for the several other marques that I need to have supported.

Say we did exit the commercial enterprises? What would we to do, in this climate, with 1. the people, 2. the stock, 3. the premises? And why on earth would we do it while they continued to contribute to the overall well-being - in ££ - of the club? No good sweet-smelling reason.

If JSL becomes an embarrassing loss-maker, with or without KCS (whose prices by the way seem to me to compare favourably with any other commercial enterprise - have a look at Tiernan, Bill Little, Honoroak or any of the others if you think otherwise), then maybe we should have the discussion. But to start this hare running just because and just when times are getting hard, seems to me to be an attempt to create a self-fulfilling prophecy and is pure negativism. Quite apart from the fact that all traders are in the same boat, and there's no guarantee that if the whole classic movement became shite-bound it wouldn't be the club schemes that came out on top. So we could be winners. But hell, what do I know?

Quite Depressed and Quite Far Away. Sorry if I'm missing something, I usually am about this time of the evening . . . it's called another glass of my preferred grape juice..

itma · Post by **itma** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 9:16 pm

I read that too; considering the origin of the letter I am not surprised, his own forum is full of whinging whining everybody is ripping me off posts.

It never failed to amuse me how a bloke would come into my shop, enquire about the price of say, a lost rocker box cap, moan about the price and then spend twice as much as that on silly little badges.
These little bits of nonsense like badges etc help the cash flow, for the simple reason more people will buy Matchless/AJS mugs etc than will buy a rear mudguard for a odd year bike.
Probably the profit margin is proportionaly greater as well.
While it would be great if all this rare tin ware & stuff was available, its not really feasible. Plus they'd only get moans about the price.
Begs the question, if the project was so bloody bad why buy it?
If a bike has masses of tin ware missing, break it or fix it with non standard stuff.
The bloke admits to buying bags of used crap parts rather than new ones, on the excuse that new bits would look out of place on his tatty bike.Then criticises the spares scheme.
Yep, I met lots like that 30 years ago, its the reason I got out.

plus ça change plus ça la meme chose

bjork · Post by **bjork** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 9:58 pm

You're right Groilly, I've just read the relevant bits and agree with every word you say. It was even more of a surprise to see that one of the complainers was Frank Westworth! The replies from Jim,CR and John Lowe all answer the queries as far as I am concerned, and I remain amazed that they need this explaining to them? Both have a long history and involvement with the club and I would have thought that if they had any concerns about the rights or wrongs of the club needing to make money in order to make spares, they would have addressed them privately to the commitee and directors first? Both seem to be wondering whether someone other than the club and it's members are benefitting from JSL and bike sales? Or have I got that wrong?

It's almost like someone starting a website and magazine, styling it as a club with a £25 subscription. Oh, and not earning anything from it, oh no! That wouldn't be 'Real (Tm)' would it? Is anyone complaining about that? Not me anyway, but I might reconsider my next renewal.

I have a Hybrid that I had to rebuild and buy lots of bits for it too. Funny, but I never had any trouble ordering from JSL, I always have trouble paying but can't blame them for that. I live close enough to drop in to Kettering now and then, have seen the place in operation, picked brains and nosed around for my own education and benefit. I've always come away glad that the club started and grew this operation. Other suppliers have always been available, but I remain convinced that without the clubs efforts (the committee and volunteers, specifically) the range of spares would be miniscule compared to the current list. I.e. the others would not be able or willing to match what JSL has. If 'Trading conditions' do knock the old bike trade eventually, I imagine a club spares scheme such as ours or VOC etc would be able to ride the storm for longer as they don't have as many outside pressures for dividends on them. Think I'll have a drink now too

Groily · Post by **Groily** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:09 pm

In which case, you're well out of it in my opinion. And you're a linguist! And I appreciate what you say.
Glad to be able to infer I should take no notice. I'd be sad if I thought there was a general view that it was not the business of a club to offer a spares scheme or engage in other commercial activity. Especially in the Jampot that contained a small ad for someone to run the Vincent Owners' Club spares scheme - which is remarkable (I have no connection nor anything beginning with V - oh, small correction, but an LE Velo can't possibly count).
So I can have another small infusion without fear of the spares scheme's being abolished overnight. Small mercies, thanks, deity, etc.

TommoT · Post by **TommoT** » Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:58 pm

I think that the Spares Scheme has attracted quite a few members over the years. Many of us have made our first contact with the club through the Spares Scheme, simply because we needed parts to finish that restauration or keep our bike on the road. So if for no other reason than that the Spares Scheme is invaluable in attracting new members.

Whether JSL should stay a commercial Ltd. company or return to a more members' owned and operated setup is a matter of opinion, but now is definitely a bad time to pull the plug on a proffessional operation like JSL. Most, if not all of the world financial crisis is the creation of hysterical investors, always on the lookout for a profit here and now, rather than longterm stability. We certainly shouldn't play that game, but instead look after our longterm interest in keeping our bikes on the road. If this can be done, and the club can make a profit in the process, I don't see any reason why we should shut down JSL Ltd. The old discussion on KCB is of no interest to me, as it seems to be more of a political and/or emotional issue. As long as it contributes to JSL and Club profits it can continue as far as I'm concerned.

Some members seem to pity J.G. for having to justify and explain JSL's operation. This is a completely wrong attitude. As the official and paid manager of JSL, he is obliged to answer questions from the membership. Also if these questions are uncomfortable and accusatory, maybe even more so if this is the case. Without proper answers and explanations from J.G., rumours and hearsay will dominate the discussion. And I think J.G. doesn't mind at all, it gives him a chance to put things right, tell the true story so to speak.

Anyway I think JSL Ltd. should continue its' present business, while the Club's board of directors should keep an eye on how it developes.

That's me off the soapbox!

orbinrangle · Post by **orbinrangle** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:38 am

The subject seems to come up quite a bit. Odd, really, as its a no brainer. I've not been around long, but joined both for the assistance given to me on this forum and for the spares scheme.

I want to know my purchases benefit the club as a whole and profits made go to strengthen the club because I want the club here next year. And the year after that. I have no doubt that the officers that run JSL and KCB are fully accountable to the membership and from the last set of published accounts it's clear they're not exactly overpaid.

Any reassurances anybody may need are there if you read the figures and the forum. I trust the board of directors to get it about right and they certainly seem to be at the moment.

Without trust we have nothing.

stevie · Post by **stevie** » Tue Jan 13, 2009 2:53 pm

Here here
I joined the club for that same reason - access to those 'in stock' and 'in the know' and have been very glad i did. It would be disasterous to me if those ties had to be severed or in any way restricted. I do hope the 'complainers' read this forum!
Steve